timebandit Posted May 10, 2010 Share Posted May 10, 2010 I've recently come into a situation whereby I'll be able to get an RC car after many years of being a teenager trapped in an old farts body. I'm looking for a Tamiya (not pre-built), probably a boomerang, frog, grasshopper type thing. (I had a boomerang when i was 12 but over the years its disappeared from my mums loft..).. My query is that when i was a kid a motor was a motor and the higher the number the better/faster.more powerful etc it was,.. since i starrted looking for a suitable car to start back into the rc thing I've come across lots of new terms, most notably "brushless" in regards to motors. I've also noticed that they are approx 4x the price of motors i would have regarded as really good bits of kit when i was younger. i realise that times move on and technology advances but i'm a bit miffed with this.. what is a brushless motor? although i'm not going to spend 200 of my hard earned quids on something unnecessary, i'd like to know how far i can take things.. Any help gratefully received.,.. PS.. I'm also considering vanessas lunchbox.. so cool after all these years.. I'm a nostalgic old fart and i make no apologies for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midi-mania Posted May 10, 2010 Share Posted May 10, 2010 welcome to the forum buddy brushless motors are i think motors that are much more powerfull than brushed motors but also require very little maintanance and they genrally seem to be paired up with a lipo lunchbox's can be picked up for Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badger906 Posted May 10, 2010 Share Posted May 10, 2010 (edited) a brushed motor has its magnets stick to the can, and uses brushes to keep the center spindle aligned (i think) which over time causes the brushes to wear, and a carbon deposite to build around the spindle in the middle which will eventually result in the motor becoming slower and slower until it needs to be skimmed on a lathe. a brusheless motor has its magnets situated on the spindle which itself is held in by bearing either end and the can is sealed. Minus the brushes and the design of the spindle makes it alot more efficient and basically quicker. Brushless motors require little or no maintanence and therefore its often a one of cost. with motors the lower the number now, the faster it is. that about sums it up in laimans terms, but here is a better explanation linky Edited May 10, 2010 by badger906 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 10, 2010 Author Share Posted May 10, 2010 Excellant thanks guys.. all of that makes senseand can be totally factored into my decision making.. I think (if i manage to get a kit) I'll stick to standard motor as my boomerang lasted years with no upgrade or maintenance neccessary considering the punishment i gave it! Thinking about it I think batteries are the main concern as they tended to run out quite quickly.. 15-20 minutes of thrash a day not really good enough to be honest! any increase in performance and longevity from them these days?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badger906 Posted May 10, 2010 Share Posted May 10, 2010 (edited) brushless motors are alot more efficient and will dramatically increase runtime on a standard nimh battery. however lipo batteries are the lastest step forward in batteries. They are obviously more expensive but dramatically increase run times. Unlike Nimh batteries and nicd, lipo cells are not incased in a metal, instead they are basically wrapped in foil. A battery consistes of far fewer cells than nimh as each cell is 3.6v instead of 1.2-1.5v lipos require a lipo charger and an esc with a lipo cut off, as if a lipo is over discharged the cell starts to break down and eat the cell wall, and the chemicals inside react violently with air causing a violent fire sounds scarey aye? however lipos are no more dangerous than normal batteries, and people just get it into there head that if you sneeze on them they will go bag... iv had a couple of nimh fires... but lipo has been faultess for me but idvancments in nimh (you probably had nicd) means batteries of today are cheap as chips, so buying several is cheaper than the jump to lipo and if its any concilation... i get about 14mins out of brushless and lipo when racing Edited May 10, 2010 by badger906 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 10, 2010 Author Share Posted May 10, 2010 Yeah i ran on ncads back in the day,. always seemed quite heavy to me and even back then thought weight would negate performance.. I'm looking at taking a trip into local model shop soon,.. the info here has been really useful and i'll certainly reference it when buying my kit! cheers.. i'll post with whaever i buy.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry Posted May 10, 2010 Share Posted May 10, 2010 Welcome to the forum (and back to the hobby) If you're just looking at those cars you mentioned, then forget LiPo, brushless etc. Those cars have been rereleased by Tamiya without any upgrades or redesigns from back in the day, so slipping in a quick brushless and a LiPo battery is a recipe for gear shreddingness. Stick to a good brushed Tamiya Sport Tuned motor and NiMH cells for some nice fun, then worry about brushless/LiPo for your next car. What I would do is... Go to the local shop and see what sort of deal they can put you together for a car, radio set, and an Ansmann xBase Deluxe charger. If they do a bearing set too, try and get it thrown in for the price. Don't worry about batteries, as a few packs of these are ideal. You'll be looking at 10-15mins runtime from each pack, more if you leave the standard silver can motor in it. When you're done, you'll have a car that will allow you to relive your youth without breaking the bank. And when you fancy something sleeker, more nimble, or just plain faster, come back and we'll see what is the latest and greatest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beankyu Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 Well, I can see it really helpfum 4 myself. Thanks a lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebedee Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 Why not go for nitro to longer run times? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kpowell911 Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 Why not go for nitro to longer run times? You can gte longer run time from electric these days. Regarding your choice of car, As Garry said, They are Re Releases. They are pretty much no different to the car you had when you was 12. I cann appreciate why Tamiya have re released them, To get people back into the hobby, BUT why do you want to pay good money for a car that is so old! They arent cheap enough to buy to have as a shelf queen, and they aren't good enough to run quality electrics to really take advantage of the major technological increases in electric power. You will be basically buying into your old car, Which will go the same speed, Run for a little longer due to the fact you can get higher capacity nimhs, But other than that, Your car is un upgradeable, It is what it is, Its a slow out dated truck. Fai enough if thats what you want, Or if its for nostaligia purposes, But the newer breed of stadium trucks etc, are alot wiser choice, Their only downside is they are often in RTR's (ie not a kit) and they have no nostalgia. Just my 2 pence, Cant understand for any reason other than nostaligia why you would want such an old design with a decent price tag. Tamiyas have a great following and originals arent difficult to source, Either buy an original or buy something better IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-D-L-88 Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 just to say i have those exact battery packs that garry has said about getting the vapextec 3700mah ones and im running a 21turn motor and get around 25mins run time, i would think you would get around 40+ mins out of a pack if you just have a stock motor in it. as i used to get 20+ mins out of a 2000mah ni cad battery on a stock motor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickHondaR Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 (edited) Hi back in the day I had a Mud Blaster http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.myrcmodels.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/mud-blaster.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.myrcmodels.com/tamiya-mud-blaster-35.html&h=193&w=300&sz=26&tbnid=h_62OjvJaaJirM:&tbnh=75&tbnw=116&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dtamiya%2Bmud%2Bblaster&hl=en&usg=__8emYTxvcfxPmyDbGD5iKE3fonBw=&ei=mH7pS6mkDIuC_Qb4usWFCw&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=2&ct=image&ved=0CCMQ9QEwAQ but being an F1 nut I bought this here are some good links / prices for parts that might be of help to you http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item518f2b82f0 (not to powerful but will be quicker) http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item563c3b5393 a good battery pack at a good price http://cgi.ebay.co.u...e=STRK:MEWNX:IT a very good charger a lot cheaper than in the uk, I have 2 of these http://cgi.ebay.co.u...em=220596427548 a decent ESC half price of a model shop, I have 2 of these http://cgi.ebay.co.u...em=360225016149 dont mess about with 27meg radio gear buy 40meg for less interference I hope all this helps you Edited May 11, 2010 by RickHondaR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 11, 2010 Author Share Posted May 11, 2010 You can gte longer run time from electric these days. Regarding your choice of car, As Garry said, They are Re Releases. They are pretty much no different to the car you had when you was 12. I cann appreciate why Tamiya have re released them, To get people back into the hobby, BUT why do you want to pay good money for a car that is so old! They arent cheap enough to buy to have as a shelf queen, and they aren't good enough to run quality electrics to really take advantage of the major technological increases in electric power. You will be basically buying into your old car, Which will go the same speed, Run for a little longer due to the fact you can get higher capacity nimhs, But other than that, Your car is un upgradeable, It is what it is, Its a slow out dated truck. Fai enough if thats what you want, Or if its for nostaligia purposes, But the newer breed of stadium trucks etc, are alot wiser choice, Their only downside is they are often in RTR's (ie not a kit) and they have no nostalgia. Just my 2 pence, Cant understand for any reason other than nostaligia why you would want such an old design with a decent price tag. Tamiyas have a great following and originals arent difficult to source, Either buy an original or buy something better IMO. Nostalgia is the main reason,.. that and i want to build it as a wee hobby because i've gone a bit stale these days.. I may buy something more up to date and technologically advanced next year if i get into the hobby as going concern, but really all iwant is a bit of nostalgic fun for now.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 11, 2010 Author Share Posted May 11, 2010 Also would like to say thanks for all the replies and information given.. I feel most welcome on this forum (I'm a member on other forums for other interests and there's usually no end of people willing to slate you for not knowing something!!) and look forward to going through the threads and picking up info as I go.. Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerrorTrooper Posted May 11, 2010 Share Posted May 11, 2010 How old are you anyway timebandit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-D-L-88 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 well, i think you have the right idea, and you should go for what ever you want, ie a tamiya re release. it wont be amazing but like you said its nostalgia. if your not worried then just go for the stuff i listed and factor in a tamiya re release instead of the mad rat which will be a bit extra but not too much. and enjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DnLegacy Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Hi folks.. Sorry to jump in here im also a new kid lol was just looking through the posts, I would love a lunchbox.. Always wanted one can you get just the body?? Anyway the easiest way of explaining the brushed/ brushless motor is they both use electro magnets to turn them round once the magnets have turned the motor over the current/power needs to swap sides to turn it again. In a brushed motor the carbon brushes put the power to the middle of the engine, they sit on the contacts and as the motor turns the contacts change over swapping the current pulling it round again.. and again and so on. In a brushless motor the magnets are in the middle and the power goes to the outside of the engine using electronics to swap the current/power to each side at the right time pulling the center around, so you no longer have the problems with the brushes wearing and dusting up the inside of the motor etc. Hope this helps anyone who cares lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Hi folks.. Sorry to jump in here im also a new kid lol was just looking through the posts, I would love a lunchbox.. Always wanted one can you get just the body?? Yep you can, its quite small though compared to other cars. They'll fit on the Tamiya Mini chassis, which are approx 160mm wide and 210mm wheelbase. Parma Lexan reproduction: http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFunction=ShowSpecification&ItemID=26786 Tamiya body set: http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFunction=ShowSpecification&ItemID=28182 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe of loath Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 They'll fit on the Tamiya Mini chassis Most awesome thing I've heard today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 I can't find a pic right now, but here's a Midnight Pumpkin on an M03 (same body dimensions): http://tamiyaclub.com/showroom_model.asp?cid=62343&id=20285 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoonmeister Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 That M03 looks awesome Garry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DnLegacy Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 That M03 looks awesome Garry! I second that.. found a few bodys on ebay might look at. Might just go for one of those junior ones to sit on a shelf lol dont want one enough to spent 20 quid on it lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kpowell911 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Nostalgia is the main reason,.. that and i want to build it as a wee hobby because i've gone a bit stale these days.. I may buy something more up to date and technologically advanced next year if i get into the hobby as going concern, but really all iwant is a bit of nostalgic fun for now.. no worries, just wanted to let you know that there are better outthere for the money. But thatsfair enough, You want Nostaligia and the Tamiya Re Releases offer just that All the best with it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 12, 2010 Author Share Posted May 12, 2010 How old are you anyway timebandit? 36 this year... although facebook age test said 67... BTW that midnight pumpkin looks awsome.. I'd also really like a Subaru Brat, I can always get a Frog body and wheels if i feel like a change as they are the same underneath (at least I think they are! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timebandit Posted May 12, 2010 Author Share Posted May 12, 2010 been trawling ebay and my local model shops website... there's some cracking looking kit out there! thinki i might get some chrome wheels for my new project.. (whenever I get the project bought of course!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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