nitro 4.6 v2 new engine installed help needed please

[jeff66]

just installed the new engine so some help needed please

 

tried to do the break in procedure for the trophy truggy but when I came to start this it revved its nuts off

 

I have 25% optifuel as stated in the book.

r5 glow plug

needles are set to factory settings

opened the throttle 1/4 of the way as stated.

looked at the carb and it was 1mm aprox

no electrics on as stated in the start up guide.

its a brand new engine only parts added to this was the pullstart and bearing and the clutch bell system for the front of the engine.

any help appreciated.

going to try and put a youtube vid on of what it sounds like later hopefully

thank

[Nitroholic]

"opened the throttle 1/4 of the way as stated."

 

If you held the throttle open 1/4, then it will rev. You have the throttle open...

 

You need to set the 1mm throttle opening with the electrics switched on. Also ensure you have no trim set on your transmitter. Lastly...check there is a tiny bit of slack in the throttle linkage. This ensures the servo isn't holding the throttle where it is ... it should be sitting on the stop screw.

 

I don;t understand why they are telling you to start it up with no electrics on. That's bizarre. Means you have no direct control over the throttle...and if it revs and the clutch engages, you can;t use the brakes either. Holding the throttle open is just to help get it started. You have stock settings, which are basically massively rich to help break in. Opening the throttle allows a lot more air in, normalising the mix a bit, giving it a good chance to start. Once it does....close the throttle. You want to run a tank or so through on idle...but again...you may need to give it a little blip of throttle to clear it through and stop the motor from stalling every now and then.

 

I would suggest reading a few of hte break in guides on here and elsewhere. There are several different schools of thought, but that way...you will get a balance and find what you feel happiest with.

 

I like to idle a tank through, let it cool....repeat...then run a couple more tanks through doing gentle figure of eights, keeping throttle low, but varied. Then a few more going up to half throttle, then moving up to 3/4. I let it cool between each tank. You will actually feel/hear the motor getting freer and revving easier as you progress. once I get through 7 or 8 tanks, I will start giving it full gas. Couple of those and I start tuning.

[jeff66]

thanks for the reply

I read the breaking in of the engine in the nitro sections and it states to have your electrics switched off.was using the hpi big block vid and booklet.

throttle trim if I put this at neutral it revs even more.

linkage what I did there was put the throttle on full to see where this stopped and then tightend the grommet screw up.

 

so I must have the electrics switched on to run the engine in is that correct.

 

 

 

thanks again

Edited August 4, 2014 by jeff66

[Baller756]

With no electrics you have no control of the engine, so if everything engages it won't plan to stop. Try it with electrics, it'll solve the problem

[jeff66]

thanks for the replys

did as you said no issues apart from the engine cutting out every so often did the spit test to see how hot the engine was and the water started to bubble.took aprox an hour and 15mins to do the 2 tanks on idle.other question is it common for the engine to rev up for a few seconds and then settle back down.

very new at rc  so thank you for all of your help much appreciated.

 

just wanted to know is the engine start up guide wrong for not switching on electrics or is that another way to break in your engine.

[jeff66]

hi all

back again done tanks 1 to 4 in trophy manual .not tune yet will have to do that later on once one of the shops have shut for the day as they have a large enough car park.

 

problems at the moment are

 

throttle trim is turned right down and the car wants to still move on its own.

if I pick the car up the front wheels go and the engine starts to rev very high.

and when the car is on the idle sounds like a constant bumble bee sound(sorry the only way I can describe this)

car settings are still at factory set.i know I can only touch the idle once I tune hsn is this correct.the cars only going to be used for general use not racing.

thanks again

Edited August 4, 2014 by jeff66

[YORKSHIRENEO]

If the car is trying to move with the throttle at idle it sounds like a clutch problem. Had this happen on my TS4N. Turned out a roller bearing inside the clutch bell had disintegrated meaning the clutch was always engaged.

[Nitroholic]

You can change the idle anytime you want. The low speed needle you need to leave alone until the high speed is right.

 

Idle too high may just be a wrong idle setting.

 

Consider also, that you are running the engine with far more fuel than it needs. That can cause all sorts of issues with rough running, and can cause things like a sudden rev up. Don;t worry too much about that as long as it;s not sustained or overheating.

 

You can easily check your clutch too. Prop the car up so all 4 wheels are off the ground with the engine off. Pull the pullstart. The wheels should not go round! You can also check side to side play on teh clutch bell. Should be virtually none.

[jeff66]

hi

thanks for the replys

I replaced clutch bearings when I had to put this back together.used existing clutch.

did the pullstart test wheels did not move with the electrics on or off .and the side to side test.

will try to alter the idle later on when I go and tune hsn first

the spit test I used water drops to see how the temp was and they bubbled for around 4 to 7 secs.

do you think I might have to replace the clutch

thanks for your replys

[jeff66]

hi

all

forgot to mention may be nothing but when I pick up the car I mentioned the front wheels moved but the rear ones do not

 thanks again.

did not manage to get out to tune the car last night as family came around

[Jamb0]

Woah woah woah, don't be so fast to change the clutch! 

 

Firstly, do you know where the idle speed screw is? (don't be afraid to ask, we can provide pictures ) DO NOT fiddle with ANY screw on the car unless you are absolutely, positively sure you know what it does! This can cause problems with the running of the engine (which as a newbie, i expect you would not be able to sort it out yourself (but don't beat yourself up about it, tuning and adjustment is tricky to perfect, and i know as i only started with nitro half a year ago)) and at worst, ruin very costly internals of the engine, be careful!

 

Next, take off the air filter with the 90* angle pipe (there is sometimes a zip tie on the engine end of the pipe which you will need to cut off to remove the pipe with the filter. The filter usually holds itself on, if it doesn't very well, just grab some new zip ties from b&q)

 

you should see a silvery plate inside the carb, and if you look closely, there will be a small gap (or in your case, most likely, a large gap!), this is your idle gap (not idle speed screw).

 

So if you know where the idle speed screw is, we can start to turn the idle speed screw (i can't remember which way does what, but as long as you dont turn it too far, this is a time to experiment lol). If you set the linkage correctly (it doesn't sound as though you did, but someone else can help with that lol) you should see the idle gap start to open or close (depending on which way you're turning the screw). Now for regular use,  you will want the gap to be open between 1-1.5mm. But before tuning you are looking for it to be set with the screw at about 3mm, and at least 4mm for starting (make sure the throttle trim on the controller is set in the middle and then turn the idle speed screw so that it is set at 3mm, and then for starting, simply turn the throttle trim on the controller ever so slightly so it is at 4mm. Then, once the engine is started and fairly warm (say 30* celcius, accounting for the fact that your engine will be colder as it is rich) simply return the throttle trim to neutral so you dont have to be messing with screwdrivers.) Once you've got it stable, put the air filter back on asap to avoid dirt and grit getting sucked into the engine. 

 

Hope this helps, i can't help a huge amount with the actual tuning as im not great at it myself lol, but hopefully you understood what i just said.

 

Good luck

Jamb0

[fatboyneil]

Nobody has asked the most important question what factory settings if their from the manual their wrong

[Jamb0]

Assuming it is the stock engine, all hpi f-star type engines have the same factory settings (and they are luckily quite simple )

 

All Needles (high speed, low speed, idle screw) are the same, simply turn the screw so that it is flush with the 'groove' (thats how they put it in the manual, but a better way would just be to say 'flush with the screw casing') eg. the high speed needle screw would be flush with the brass cylinder that surrounds the screw. 

 

Hope this helps

Jamb0

 

p.s. you might be better off just taking the car to your local hobby shop (LHS as it's known on this forum) and just get them to sort it out for a small charge. As it's a used car, they may also spot underlying problems that even more experienced car owners wouldn't spot. for example, i got my used car working myself, but decided to just get it checked. And the guy found a huge number of problems, (to name a few); Steering knuckles broken (kinda obvious, but at the time i wouldn't have known about it), steering bushings knackered (cheap repair luckily) and the worst (and most expensive) was the whole chassis was bent like a banana! This was probably due the previous owner smashing it into a wall or mislanding a jump, but it involves striping the entire car down, and using a special tool to straighten it back up; very costly.

[jeff66]

hi all sorry not been back and replied for a while had to dog sit for a week

yes I am very new to the hobby factory settings was set flush as stated in booklet..i took the engine off and removed the clutch shoes these pulled apart very easily.

ordered a new set and you could not pull these apart,so replaced the old ones with the new ones put everything back together.

 

started the engine up as I turnd the throttle trim down there was a grinding sound as if it was coming from the clutch bell.everything was cleaned before putting back.

 

I was told by hpi to turn the idle screw anti clockwise in 1/8th turns until the engine stalls and once this happens turn it clockwise 1/8th and that is the ideal setting.non of the likage has been touched.i have also watched the big block video by hpi on how to run the engine in at least 20 + times.

 

I have tried to put a video link from youtube but it will not let me paste the link on here so if you type in on youtube 

 

  trophy truggy 4.6 noise help         you will see the vid plus another of the car.

 

thanks again

[jizwizard]

idle is too high for a start. Cant here the grinding noise but I would suspect you have the clutch bell to close to the spur. You want it so you can get a fag paper between it to put it bluntly

[jeff66]

update

took the engine off and checked for leaks blocked the carb hole and exhaust hole up .put piece of pipe on the fuel inlet and then blew.heard a leak .put soapy water on and the leak was coming from the screw that holds the carb in place.could this be the problem with the high revving.if so do I need to put a little sealeant around the screw.

 

thanks again

[jeff66]

hi

thanks for the reply

 

I wnet anticlock wise with idle screw until it cut out and then went clockwise about 1/8th of a turn was a bit better

[jeff66]

update

I sealed the carb and pinch screw where it was leaking air and also the back plate.

replaced the clutch shoe and bearings

set the  servo to neutral and put everything on the neutral position on the controller.

carb gap was set at 1mm opening in neutral as well as when the brakes was applied .

all needles set to factory settings flush

car still idles vey high and wants to take off on its own,even with the throttle trim turned right down.

wheels still spin when lifted of the floor.

had a temp gun and the temp was getting over 144 celsius and still risingsometimes 160 c

I did turn the idle screw anticlockwise to see if it would cut the revving down but to me it worked but was still revving very high.

any other ideas would be apreciated

thanks again